Aimee Gianni is a seasoned marriage and family therapist and relationship coach, with a focus on guiding couples and individuals through the complexities of relationships for nearly three decades.In this episode, Aimee shares her perspective on the transformative power of relationships, especially highlighted during the pandemic’s unique challenges. She emphasizes the importance of self-awareness, communication, and connection as foundational elements of a healthy relationship. She shares her suggestions for keeping the flame burning and understanding love languages between you and your partner.Aimee also talks about the balance between sexuality and spirituality within marriage, challenging common misconceptions and encouraging couples to view their intimate connection as an integral part of their spiritual and emotional bond. If you’re looking for help in rekindling passion into your marriage, you’ll love her approach and the practical advice she shares in this episode!
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Okay. Amy, I'm so excited to have you on the podcast today. So grateful that we have become friends and for all of your incredible wisdom. And I just can't wait to share you with anyone that listens to this podcast. So for anyone who isn't familiar with you, Amy, I know you're a really big deal in the coaching space, but if someone isn't in that space and they don't know of you yet, can you just share a little bit about who you are and what you do?
Yes, thank you for having me. I'm so excited to be here. I always love talking with you. Um, so I am a marriage and family therapist slash relationship coach. And so, um, I've been working with couples and individuals for like close to 30 years. Um, and I also train other coaches how to work with relationships in their coaching practices.
So that's what I do. Amazing. And you have two incredible boys who are bodybuilders. Yes. So amazing. They're 25 and they're the loves of my life. So yeah, they're awesome. They love to work out and do physics. They're little physics nerds that are also bodybuilders. So. So fun. And we all got to spend time together in Hawaii.
So that was really fun and unique, but okay. Today we're going to talk about relationships in general, and then hopefully go into some. Well, little nuances that I feel like you're an expert on. So I'm just out of curiosity, like what led you to wanting to do this or feeling like this is your life's work or your life's calling?
Yeah, I've just always loved relationships. Even as a kid, I've just was always watching. People and couples. And I've always been a connector. Like I love to connect one on one with people and create meaningful relationships. And so I was always just intrigued by relationships and what made good relationships and what made challenging relationships.
And my parents got divorced when I was about 12. So that added another piece to it. And so, yeah, I've just always loved this work. That's so cool. So. And you were telling me that you, um, in like, you know, during the pandemic, you saw this like huge, like need for coaches and for people who could help others with relationships.
And so I'd love to just talk a little bit about that. Like how I feel like to people have really become so much more aware of their relationships because I think before the pandemic, everyone was just kind of like busy and in their lives and not paying attention to it. And then we all got stuck at home with each other.
And people became so much more aware of the dynamics and that maybe the things that they just kept themselves too busy to pay attention to. And I love that that's always something that you say, like have awareness, like be willing to look at yourself, be willing to think about who you are and what you're bringing to the table.
So, um, so let's talk about that and what you think about all of that. Yeah. I mean, I think all of a sudden we were, we were home and all these things that we maybe were, had been avoiding with busyness were like right, right in front of us. And so, um, and I think for, there was so much good that came out of it.
I think people did become aware of a lot of different things, things that were good about their relationship, as well as things that were difficult because there was no escaping it. Yeah. There was nowhere to go. So, yeah. So, um, I just think it was an interesting time. And. time for people to have more time to have awareness.
I think people were home listening to podcasts or they were, you know, watching different things. And, um, my practice actually was really busy during the pandemic. You know, a lot of, um, different businesses had to close down, but it's something that people really dove into during the pandemic. Yeah, well, I remember my therapist, I actually was meeting with my therapist twice a week for a while during 2020 because I had just horrible debilitating postpartum depression.
And so she was like, let's meet twice a week for a while until you start feeling better. And you know, and then we can spread it out or whatever. But she also told me that. She was so slammed during 2020 that she just felt so bad. She just kept having to turn people away because the need was so great during that time.
So that is really interesting. And then as, as you started working with those couples or those, you know, relationships, where do you start with someone who's like, Oh my gosh, I'm. Okay, I'm looking at myself and it's kind of scary, like maybe I don't like what I see. What do you tell people when they first start to uncover some of those things about themselves?
Yeah, so I always say the first step is really untangling because people are really tangled up in their relationships. And so a lot of it is unraveling that and helping each individual come to know who they are and what they want so that they can stand on their own two feet, but yet still be close to each other.
Um, and, and so the first step of untangling is, um, like self reflection. It is like taking a look in the mirror, um, and getting to self confrontation. And yeah, sometimes, especially in relationships, because relationships hold a mirror up to us. Mm hmm. Reflects back, like, who we are and how this person that you're so close to, how they experience you.
And yeah, sometimes we don't really like what we see. But the beauty of it is If we're willing to look at it, we may not like it at first, but that is the path to freedom, right? That is the path to growth to look at it. So a lot of times I'll just, um, help them be a compassionate observer, right? So they can learn how to observe not only others, but especially themselves with compassion so that when they see these things that they maybe don't like, rather than judging themselves and going to shame, they're able to just take a look at it with compassion because I always say, um, When we look through a shame lens, if we immediately go to shame, shame keeps us from accessing the very thing we need to move forward.
Hmm. Okay. So if we have shame, it's the shame is going to kind of distract us from looking at the information that's there, but if we can peel back the shame, be compassionate with ourselves, we'll see, Oh yeah, this is, this is a thing that I do that I really don't like that I do, that I really do want to change and ask the information you need to be able to move forward.
Yeah. I love that. So what if someone is feeling shame, do you, what do you tell them? Like what are some tips or what are some things that they can do to not just feel stuck in that? Yeah. Well, I always go to the three C's compassion, courage, and connection. So, um, when people are feeling shame, having compassion for themselves, um, reaching out to others.
So, you know, this is all based on the work of Brene Brown, who's the great shame researcher, right? Yeah. Yeah. Um, and she talks about sharing your story story with those who've earned the right to hear it. That connection piece, if you're feeling shame, because shame can only exist in the dark, right? If we hide, and that's what we want to do when we feel shame, we usually want to hide.
Yeah. But if we can reach out from that and reach out to somebody that we trust and share our story, that will help decrease our shame. Okay. So it takes a lot of courage. So I just need compassion, courage, and connection. are the things that will help us become shame resilient. Yeah. How do you counsel people who are like, well, I, I need like that safe person, but I don't know who's safe.
Like how, who has earned the right to hear your story? Yeah. It's a really good question. Right. And only you can decide who you feel comfortable sharing with. But for me, I want to know that somebody, um, is it going to be telling everybody else my story, right? Like, I want to know that that person is. that is going to be confidential and that they're going to take it seriously.
Yeah. So that's something that, that I look for. Um, but yeah, I just kind of have to walk them through like, who's in your life? Who are you thinking about sharing with? Why would you share with them? Why wouldn't you share with them? And just kind of help walk them through that process. Yeah. I remember, gosh, when Neil and I were very first in his like outpatient rehab program for pornography addiction, I was talking to a counselor in that, in that situation about how I felt so isolated because I hadn't told anyone yet.
And I was like, I need someone, I need like one person to talk to. And I remember their advice was just make sure that whoever you're picking, that they their identity is not rescuing others. If they're the kind of person that's like always rescuing the person, um, in need, then they're probably not an ideal person.
And I didn't understand why at the time. And ironically, I kind of knew in my gut that like the person I was going to tell was that kind of person, but I was like, Oh, but, but she makes me feel so safe. And she's like one of my closest friends. And, um, so I went against that advice. And what happened was She totally resented me, you know, down the road when I didn't like reciprocate what she, what her expectations were of me after she had like rescued me.
And so that was really interesting. Um, but I don't know what's your, like now looking back, I'm like, was that it? Or what, what do you think the I don't know. Do you have anything else? I mean, you said like find someone who you feel like is going to be, you know, hold your story and confidence. So probably someone who you haven't ever heard gossip about other people or share other people's secrets.
Number one. But then also like, what's your perception of like why you wouldn't want to pick someone who that's kind of their identity to be like every, you know, other people's like, they're the one that comes in and saves the day always. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because I think usually those kind of people, um, have an agenda and so you want to tell your story to somebody that doesn't have an agenda or their worth isn't tied to whether or not they help you or whether or not you take their advice.
Right. Interesting. Finding somebody without an agenda makes a difference. So that's somebody that can just like walk alongside you. They're not gonna be in front of you, like leading you, telling you what to do. Mm-Hmm. , right? But they're just a friend that can walk alongside you and allow you to feel pain.
Um, like I just went through an experience that was really, really emotionally difficult for me. And it was interesting because. I would have friends that could walk beside me and just listen and just like kind of hold your hand right yeah through it all and just like be there and be like yes I see you and um I'm witnessing this and that is hard and and being there for me but then there were other people that if I would talk to them about things it's almost like they couldn't handle my pain they wanted me out of pain so badly yeah they're like well here you need to do this or why aren't you doing this and then that wasn't helpful for me right like I didn't know what to do.
I needed somebody that could be okay with my emotion. And so I think that's another interesting thing is finding somebody that can sit with you in your pain without trying to fix it or solve it. Well, let's talk about that in marriage because I feel like that is something that Neil and I have definitely dealt with at times where like, um, you know, when he was dealing with his grief, it took me a while to realize that I was being super codependent with.
I felt like it was my duty. I felt like if I cared, I would try to like fix this for him because he was in so much pain and it honestly took me at least a year. a year and a half, maybe even like the first two years to kind of wake up and realize like, Oh my gosh, I'm managing his grief. And this is not mine to manage.
Like, it's just going to take what it takes. And he's in charge of that and not me. And it's not my job to save him from this, from his feelings. But how do you, um, But a lot of times Neal just like wants, if he sees me in pain, especially if it's something he caused, he just wants it to go away. He's like, here, what do I say?
Like, he will literally ask me like, well, what do you want me to say? Cause he just wants it to go away, but yeah, but how do you counsel people who with great intentions just want like to hurry and fix people? Yeah. So it's all about taking a look at why, why do you need to hurry and fix someone? Like what are you avoiding within you that makes it so hard?
Right. For you to sit there with them because there's usually, you know, it's like, well, you know, for him, like in that example that you gave, it's reminding him that he did something that he probably didn't want to do or isn't super proud of. Right. He's like, Oh, I just want this to go away. Yep. But yeah, I think it's, it's just helping the person take a look at what are you avoiding in yourself?
What is it hard for you to look at that? Hmm. Makes it hard for you to sit with someone else's emotion. Yeah, and if I'm being really honest with my grief, um, sorry, his grief and my, like, role in that, like, yes, I cared and I wanted him to feel better, but if I'm being really, really honest about my intention there, A big part of that was like, I just was like, okay, we got to get back to life.
Like we got to, like, I need you to be a little more functional because you're supposed to be the second half of everything here. You're my business partner. You're my life partner. You're my parenting partner. You're my spouse. Like I, I need you to like, at what point do we start moving on with life? And that it's, it's like, a little bit, um, shameful or whatever to look back, but that's the truth.
That's the truth of why I was like, yeah, I don't want you to hurt, but also like, I need you to function, you know? And then when I finally realized like, oh, I'm just trying to make this go away and, and it's not my job to make it go away. And I just need to let him be in charge. And I started thinking of it.
Like I thought of his recovery, his addiction recovery. I was like, oh, this is not, I don't have to manage this. This is, he, he will figure it out on his own terms. And it was so freeing for me to realize that it wasn't like my responsibility to do that. Yeah. I was going to say that's freedom, right? That's freedom when you can let go of that.
Although it's, it's kind of feels like free falling first, right? Cause you're like, Oh gosh, what is this? Yeah, that's so true. Um, I love what you were teaching Billy and me on, um, on the beach in Hawaii where we, so this is kind of a total shift, but it's just something that has like affected my marriage and it's something that I haven't stopped thinking about that I feel like people don't talk about.
And, and sometimes if they do, they're, they, it feels like it has to be so extreme that I'm like, Whoa, that doesn't necessarily align. And it doesn't feel like. Aligned with this like really good person that I want to be, but you were teaching us that spirituality and sexuality can be, or should be, um, I don't know what's the word that they should, they should coexist that they, that they're like friends and not enemies.
They go hand in hand. Yeah. Sexuality and spirituality complement one another. They're meant to be together. Um, not opposites, right? And I think a lot of times, um, the teachings, like very conservative Christian teachings sometimes and others as well. I like, you know, like sexuality is this bad part of us or this evil part of us that we, you know, yes, we engage in it, but we don't really want to talk about it or think about it because it's the opposite of what we want.
Like, really, we want to be spiritual. So it's almost like those two opposing factors when really, want to be. Um, our sexuality, I believe is such a beautiful gift from God and it's such a beautiful part of who we are. It's part of our core identity, our sexuality. And so obviously to use it for good and in the way that, you know, fits with your, and aligns with your morals and your values.
Um, but within a marriage, I think that beautiful, connected, having a beautiful, connected sexual relationship actually increases your connection with each other. And can be spiritual. Like it increases spirituality. Yeah, that's so interesting because I feel like I know that and it feels right when you're saying it but it's hard to apply sometimes and I think that you know, the other thing that the three of us were all kind of connecting on was that it can be so hard to be like a mom or a wife or working or whatever where You're giving, giving, giving, giving all day.
And then you get to the end of the day and you're supposed to connect and it's so hard to like switch your mindset into that's something that I want. Not like that's something that someone wants from me. How do you, how do you counsel people who are like, gosh, I want to get better at that, but it's, I'm not really sure how to go about it.
And especially if you're someone who's like, I'm trying to have be this like. Good person with good thoughts and like keep myself really spiritually. I mean, I've had these conversations with other women who were like, I want to surround myself with all things that are keeping me like constantly in a flow with God.
So it feels a little like, um, I don't know the right word for it. It feels like a contrast, you know, to try to like then switch into that mindset. And what I would say. Is my belief is that god wants us having a beautiful sexual relationship with our spouse We're thinking about um creating that connection with our spouse It is the same thing as staying like focused on Goodness and on bringing us unto christ and closure.
Yeah Um, so just And I know that that's such a big shift for a lot of people because like I was saying they think of them as opposite, right? So it's almost like, well, if I'm going to take my brain there, it's taking me away from God. But I would say it, it keeps you in alignment with God. Um, but yeah, when, when sex feels like it's something that someone is taking from you, does not feel good.
Right. And so, yeah, because you're giving all day and doing all the things. And then it's like, okay, now I have to go give to my spouse. But if you can shift that to thinking, Of something that, um, that you're receiving, right? How you're going to receive love and connection from your spouse. And it's almost like, um, like you walk into it side by side.
So rather than like being across the table from each other, like here, can I have this from you? Well, I want that. And it becomes transactional. If you think of sitting on the same side of the table or next to each other hand in hand, like, Almost like it's an amusement park. Like, hey, here's this fun amusement park.
Like, should we go? Do you want to go with me? Let's go in together. So you're going in together as a way of expressing love and connecting and receiving love. So I think when it can become something that you're receiving, um, as opposed to just something that you feel taken from, that shifts the energy around it.
Yeah, that's a really good suggestion. Um, I still, I still want like some tips cause you gave us some really good tips and Hawaii where Billy and I were like, okay, but still, how do we get in that mindset? Because we're both exhausted at the end of the day. Um, so how do you counsel women who are like, I, like, I want that.
I, there's a desire in me that wants to be there, but like, I seriously have a hard time getting, getting to that. Yeah. You know, place. So, um, Emily Nagoski, uh, in her book, Come As You Are, she talks about spontaneous desire versus responsive desire. Typically, men have spontaneous desire where they are good to go, like right now, okay, I'm ready.
Right? Yeah. Yeah. Whereas women, it just takes longer. Usually, not always, but usually we have more responsive desire. So. Yeah. Um, you know, once our spouse starts making advances, then we start responding and then our desire goes up. So you want to think about if it, if you, if you need to get up to a 60, right, if you got to get from zero to 60 to be like ready and excited about it, and you're living in zero, every single time is going to feel like such a chore, right?
Yeah. But if you can get to where you live at a 30 or a 40 or a 50. It's you're going to be so much more excited about it and engaged in it, right? And it's, it's not going to seem like such a chore. So you want to give like, that's your responsibility to get yourself there to be living there. And you, so whatever is meaningful for you, like, I know we were talking about wearing lingerie, like put on lingerie during the day, right?
Lingerie that will help start getting you in the mood or thinking about it or flirty texts. Um, But get that started like way before nine o'clock at night when you're both exhausted and falling into bed and hoping that kids, you know, stay asleep. Yes, and the lingerie tip really has been super helpful for me.
I kind of like wrote, wrote that off, um, after, you know, it's funny, like when, at least for me, when we first got married, like I bought a bunch of that stuff and then we never used it. Cause it was like, Oh, the clothes all come off so fast that it's like, it was like a waste of money. For me now, it's interesting being like almost 40 and having.
Buy freaking kids. Like I still am like, how do I have five kids, five kids and a full time business. And, um, you know, I'm around Neil all the time. So I kind of wear this uniform of like, people talk about like the mom form. So I'm like, you know, sometimes in workout clothes, a lot of times in sweats, sometimes in like, you know, jeans and a sweater, like I am today, but it's kind of like this uniform of like, I'm either.
You know, mom running kids to school or I'm like businesswoman and, you know, doing a podcast interview with you or I'm making dinner for my kids or I'm, you know, I'm usually in one of those functions and I kind of have like this uniform for it. So for me, this has been like a brand new thing since we came home from Hawaii when you were like, try lingerie and I was like, okay, I really haven't liked that.
Given that like a fair shot other than like every once in a while when we go on vacation and actually this was something that you helped me with where I was like, it's so much easier when I'm on vacation and you were like, why? And I was like, I don't know why it just is because like I don't have any kids around me and we're in like a sunny place and that's like why we're there and you're like, but why?
So that is something that I usually bring on like a vacation, but I don't think about it at home because it's just kind of like, okay, well, we got to do it. So, or, or, I mean, sometimes I'm in the mood, but a lot of times it's like, okay, I want to do this because it's a good thing for my marriage and it's not really like, um, It's harder for me to get there to be like, Oh, that is what I want.
Like, that sounds as good as like a bowl of ice cream at the end of the day, you know? So for whatever reason that using that lingerie has been helpful for me to be like, I'm putting on a different uniform and this is like the intention right now. This isn't like, I'm taking off like the clothes that have like spit up and you know, half of dinner and flour and whatever all over them.
Um, and I'm done with that part of the day. And now this is like, The intention that was super helpful for me. So for anyone who's listening to this, who's like, kind of, you know, a little bit later on in their marriage, maybe, and you gave that up years ago, like it's definitely worth thinking about trying again.
Cause for me, it's been helpful to just like have even that, like few minutes in my closet all by myself, you know, I go in there and close the door and then I just like shift my mindset of like, okay, now the intention is this. Yes. Yeah. And it is, it's like, we oftentimes think, well, this is just for my spouse.
It's for him because he wants me to wear lingerie. I think lingerie is just as much for me, right? As for a spouse, because I love putting it on. And I don't know, I just think it does help shift your mind and how you see yourself, right? Now you don't see yourself in the clothes with spit up, but you see yourself as this like, sexy desirable woman or whatever.
Yeah. Yeah. And I think even wearing it, like, so you can think of it as changing, like, You know, at the end of the day or whatever, or I just think it's fun sometimes to wear it just under your uniform, right? Whatever your uniform is, just a little surprise, like, yeah, here it is. Yeah. I love that idea too.
That's so fun. And the other thing that I like, I'm bummed that we haven't done this yet, but it was such a good idea. And I still want to was when you were like, okay, your kids are, cause you spent time around my kids. No, the, how old they are, or at least my. Two oldest daughters. We all went to Hawaii and we took, Neil and I took just our oldest two.
So, um, you were like, they're old enough. They can watch the other kids and you guys can say like on a Friday night or whatever, like this is mom and dad's night. You go in, you lock the door and say like, unless there's blood, don't bother us. And, um, and we haven't done it yet, but I want to, and that's such a good idea.
And, um, And my question for you is like, well, what if they hear stuff and yeah, you know, I was like, what if they can tell what's going on? And you're like, I don't know. I loved your response to that. So what was your advice? Yeah. I was like, yeah. So what? What if? What if? Yeah. Who cares? Right. Not that, um, not that they, you want them hearing like all sorts of things or whatever, but, but them here and knowing that that's what you're doing.
Like you want your kids to know that you and Neil love each other and that you have a good marriage and that you want to be together because a healthy sexual relationship is part of a good, beautiful marriage. And you want your kids to have that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's so true. People say that all the time.
They're always like, Oh no, but what if they know, what if they. suspect something, figure it out. Yeah. I'm like, well, they probably will at some point and good because this is what married people do. Right. Yeah. Yeah. No, that was a good mind shift for me to be like, Oh yeah, I guess. What if like, it's probably a good thing.
Um, okay. So another question about all of this, when you're, cause you talked about like the simmer and keeping a simmer going and, um, Um, what do you tell couples when they have totally different ways of trying to connect or, or feeling, you know, like the love language thing. If you've got like one person who really likes physical touch and the other person doesn't respond to that well, and then their, their love language is whatever, pick another one, like, um, words of affirmation.
And so how do you tell people to like reconcile those two if they're trying to keep things Simmering or, or not just like have to fully ignite the flame from zero at, you know, when they're finally together. Yeah. I do talk about like keeping it at a sexual simmer. So it's just red. You can just get to boiling at any point, right?
Yeah. Um, yeah. So I think love languages oftentimes are just so misused because oftentimes people We'll, um, take the little quiz. I'll be like, well, this is my love language. This is how my spouse should be loving me. And they almost look at it from an entitled place, right? Like, why aren't you doing this for me?
This is who I am. You should be speaking my language. But I think it's much more helpful if you can look at it as, I want to know my spouse's love language, almost just like a Christmas list, right? If somebody is like. If you want to give them a Christmas gift, you're like, what do you want for Christmas?
Tell me, because I want to get you something that you are going to absolutely love. Yeah. So I think when you can use the information from love languages to. learn about your spouse and what they like, then you can give that to them from a place of generosity, never from a place of obligation, right? You don't ever want it to be like, Oh gosh, okay.
He likes physicals touch. I guess that means we have to have sex again. Right? That doesn't ever feel fun. No. Like, Oh, this is important to me. He loves physical touch. So when he comes home, I want to go sit right by him. Right? Like I want to, Rub his shoulders like I want to hold his hand because I love and I want to give to him in that way.
So I think when couples so a lot of times I will talk to couples about it just as a way of educating them about this is how your spouse receives love. This is how your spouse gives love so that they can almost see it. with more compassion, right? And then they understand what their spouse is doing. Yeah.
Yeah. That's great advice. And I, I mean, I loved your take on that, so I'm glad we got to talk about it here too. Okay. I have a little bit harder question. Maybe it's not hard. Maybe it's not hard for you, but it's always been hard for me when, um, you know, we've shared our story so many times. on here and on my blog and Instagram and whatever about Neil being a recovering pornography addict and me being a recovering codependent.
And people know that story if they've, you know, if they've been following us for a while or we've been friends or whatever for a while. And so when women come to me and they want me to give them advice about how to work on themselves or how to work on their healing or how to make progress, like I can talk to them.
For days about that and be so confident and know exactly what to say, but when people come to me and they say, well, what about feeling safe sexually? What if, what about feeling safe in your intimate relationships? What about trust? What about if you have these hurtful things come back up? And I'm just like, uh, I don't know.
Cause I don't have the answer for that. I feel like I've worked on it, but I don't feel like I've nailed it. And, um, yeah. I, I feel like those things have like healed themselves over time in some ways. And then in other ways, I'm like, I still don't know that I fully understand or I don't know. So, so all of that to say, I would love your advice for, you know, a couple who's in that situation.
So safety is really, really important. Um, if you're going to give yourself sexually to your partner, you want to feel safe. So, um, safety matters. And I think having a conversation about that, sometimes it's harder to do just on your own without a coach or a therapist, but you can and talk about what you want and need in the relationship in order to feel safe.
Um, and you know, the idea of trust is always interesting because trust really is a choice. You're never going to actually know if somebody is 100 percent trustworthy. You just can't ever know that. Right. Um, but you can look for evidence that they are trustworthy. Right. So, um, if you see evidence that someone is trustworthy and you choose to trust them, that's what that, that's what that looks like.
Right. You're never going to get to the point where you're like 100 percent sure that. Nothing is ever happening or he's never looking at it at all. You just can't ever know that. Um, but you also don't have to have that knowledge in order to trust it. Trust is a choice. But again, I want to highlight, like you do want to be intentional about who you trust, right?
I'm not saying, Oh, just choose trust. No big deal. Yeah. But, um, if you see trustworthy behaviors, that's when you can start feeling more comfortable to make a choice of trust. Um, and, um, safety and sexuality is, is really important. And sometimes like women will freeze, right? Especially if they have any kind of trauma around it.
Or if they start having stuff coming to their mind about it, they're going to flee and you have to address the safety before you can continue on with the sexuality. And so a lot of that is embodiment work and helping women figure out, like, where are these emotions in their body and what do they need to do for themselves to create safety?
And also what do they need to ask their partner for in order to create that safety? Interesting. So, like, what are some. If someone were like, I have no idea what to, where to even start with that, what would you tell them? Yeah. Um, I would say notice when it comes up for you, like, do you find yourself shutting down or is it like, if you're making dinner and he puts his hand on your back that you like freeze, right?
Like when is it coming up? And then just getting really curious with yourself about, okay. What is this about? Um, what's going on in my brain? Like what, like when we were in Hawaii and I kept whatever you'd ask me, I'd be like, well, why, why, right? Yeah. It's one of the best questions to get inside your brain and see what you're actually thinking.
So if you're like, well, I'm not sure what it is in the moment, you want to get really curious with yourself. The next time you find yourself freeze and be like, okay, why am I freezing? What's going on for me right now? What am I feeling in my body? And just taking it back to that awareness. Um, yeah, that's a really good, um, good advice.
I'm wondering too, like, okay, so let's say that, um, someone is like, they, you know, are trying to do this, they're trying to explore it, they kind of don't know why, but they're trying to choose. To trust and all of that. And then they find themselves, you know, you said that like it has to be addressed. And I feel like you've given me great advice with this before.
Like, are you addressing that in the moment? Are you addressing it later on when you're out of this scenario or like how, what's the advice there? Yeah, not in the moment, right? Like you want to get to where your nervous system is regulated and you're in a more grounded place. That's where you have that discussion.
So in the moment, you want to recognize it in yourself and get curious with yourself to see what's going on. But yeah, that is not the time to have the conversation with your spouse. Yeah. It is an okay time to say, Hey, I want you to touch me, but not right now. Or, you know, something's coming up for me.
Like you can say something like that to set a boundary or give them a message. That now is not the time for you, but yeah, it's not the time to have the conversation and yeah Yeah, that's so helpful because I think that most of us just feel like well, we got to talk about it We're supposed to and then sometimes in it like right when the thing happens or whatever all everyone's emotions are heightened and then it's like The worst time.
Yeah. Well, and the interesting about that, about taking a pause is that it allows you to get clear and decide, okay, you know, in the moment, it feels like it's at 100, right? And then as you get away from it, you might be like, yeah, this is important, but it's really like a 55, right? So yes, I want to address it, but you're kind of able to see it.
Um, For what it is and figure out how big of a deal it is for you. And sometimes, honestly, things can go away, right? So that's the reason you want to get some space from it, because sometimes you'll decide, actually, this is something that I want to let go of. I don't, I don't even want to it to be a part of things.
So I want to let go of it. Yeah, and that's such a powerful part of for me at least it's been such a powerful part of recovery of just like deciding on Certain things like oh, it feels right now. I'm ready to let it go. I'm ready to release this I'm ready to detach from you know, whatever it's been bringing into my life.
So That's been a really powerful thing for me, too I have definitely though heard from women who are just like You You know, I can't get this out of my head or I can't every time we go to do this this is like all these thoughts come flooding and I Like that's one thing that I feel like I don't relate to so if if you can speak directly to that I think that would be so helpful, too.
Yeah Well, and I think if it's really really like that I think working with somebody would be really important a therapist or a coach to help you with that because that's very real, right? Yeah, trauma response is what it is Because, um, when all of that comes into your brain, you end up again, it like flares up your nervous system, right?
So your, your nervous system is all lit up, um, and it would be good also, maybe not in the moment, you can't do it, but to write down, like, what are all the thoughts that come to your brain in that moment? Like, what are you thinking? What is this flood that comes upon you so that you can go back and look at those thoughts individually and be like, okay, What am I going to do with this one?
What am I going to do with that one? Do I want to hold on to this one? Because sometimes things feel so true in your brain, but as soon as you write it down and look at it, you're like, Oh yeah, that's, that's not even true. Or I don't even want to hold on to that. Yeah. Get some freedom and power over it that way.
Yeah, I have a question for you too about, um, since you just said like, you know, maybe work with someone. I feel like you have such a unique perspective because you are a therapist and you like you put on the therapist hat, but you also have like the coach hat and you understand both of those. And tell me what you think about this because I feel like with women that I've sponsored in the 12 steps or just people that I've known in recovery.
The people who and I've even experienced this to a certain degree myself. I feel like sometimes with therapy people will go into those situations and they'll turn into a situation where like they open the wound and then like every time they go to therapy they're like opening it back up and they're picking at it and they're like it's like the scab that will never heal because it's just constantly getting picked at where I feel like you know some of the 12 step work that I've done or coaching or things like that, where it's a little more forward focused, it gets you out of that.
Like, let's just obsess about like, you know, people will call it D day, like discovery day or like the, the trauma and the wounds and, and betrayal, trauma, like all of this stuff. I'm not saying that it's not valid or it's not real, but I see people who tend to. Get stuck in kind of some of those ruts because it seems like sometimes not all the time, but sometimes in therapy can just become like the focal point of like, let's just keep reliving the past.
I don't know. So what's your perception or like, what's your take on that? Because you, you have a really healthy way of like doing both. Yeah. Well, I think, um, healing. Is being able to tell a different story about it, right? And forgiveness, that's really forgiveness too. Like if you are, um, choosing to forgive, like forgiveness is for us, right?
But it's telling a different story. It's not denying what happened. But it's being able to shift your perspective and tell a different story about it. And so, yeah, when people come in, like, we do need to dig in and, like, find the hurt and, like, see it. And, you know, I witness it for people and we go through that.
What does that feel like? All of the emotional work, right? But then it's like, okay, and now what do you want to do with this? Right? And you don't go there too soon because if you try to go there too soon, then it's like the wound doesn't get all the way cleaned out. Yeah. You don't want to keep opening it up, but you want to open it up, lean it out, deal with what's there and then say, okay, now what, now what's the story you want to tell with this?
How do you want to move forward with this in your life? And I think that's really what healing is. And so when you can take the beauty of therapy and the beauty of coaching and combine it, I just think it's so powerful. Yeah, it's so empowering to be like, look at that and say, you're in charge, like how, you know, this is your story.
This is your life and not like, this is what happened to me and I have no choice but to be stuck there. Yes. Yeah. It's where our power comes in, right? That's where we can get ourselves to that empowered place where. we're no longer a victim to our story. Like we can still be a victim of something that happened to us, but we don't want to be a victim to our story, right?
We can tell a more empowered story and still acknowledge the thing that happened. Yeah. As true. Um, but how we see it is where we get all of our power. Yeah. One last question on this topic that I get asked and I, I kind of don't, even though I've been divorced and remarried, um, I get questions from women who are like, how, you know, they've ended that relationship.
They've ended that marriage and they're like, how am I ever supposed to trust? Another guy isn't going to just come in with all these lies and secrets and then I'm going to get, you know, blindsided. And I, I don't, other than telling them, like, pray about it and God will lead you. I don't really know how to tell someone to like move forward from something like that.
Yeah. Well, and it's tricky and that's good advice, right? Like being really, if you know yourself, I think if you have really good awareness of yourself, you are able to pick up on clues from other people, right? You're going to be able to map people that are around you, like mind mapping, right? Like, yeah, I'm picking up on something here.
But. It is going to come back to not, um, to the fact that trust is a choice. And so you're not really going to know if somebody is completely trustworthy. All you can do is go on what you see from them. Yeah. Yeah. I love that. And I think too, it was empowering for me when I, um, did therapy in between my first husband and then meeting and marrying Neil, that, um, I did like unpack all of those wounds and all those hard things.
And I had a therapist that told me. I know it feels like this reality is the reality with every man out there, but like every man is not a bad man. Like they, you know, and or that there, everyone isn't going to hurt you the way that you were hurt the first time. And that was helpful for me to hear because there's something about going through something that's very real to you that feels like this is the only reality that could possibly exist, you know?
And, and that like everyone has a secret or that everybody's kind of going to secretly like ruin your life or something, you know, um, that was helpful for me to hear that. Like, no, there, there is like. There are healthy relationships out there. There are people who are happy. And I guess that's like one of the key core messages that you love to share with people about like, you're not going to just walk into every relationship and then find out what you're doomed to have to like deal with for the rest of your life.
Right? Yeah, yes. I always say like relationships are meant to be enjoyed, not endured. And so, um, a lot of times people just kind of white knuckle it through their relationship. Marriages thinking like this is their duty or this is what they're supposed to do. And it, it's so sad to me because yes, there's going to be difficulties and trials along the way, but there should be more joy and happiness, right?
That, that should definitely outweigh in the long run. You might go through periods where it feels like it's more trial or more frustration. But, um, overall on the average, you want to have more joy. And happiness in your relationships, they shouldn't just be something that you have to endure. Yeah. I love that.
I really believe that too. Okay. Amy, um, last question for you. If there is one message that you want the person who's listening to this to remember, what do you want that one message to be? That relationships are, can be difficult, but they're worth the work. Relationships are healing. I think there's, we can grow and develop in relationships Um, more than we can just on our own.
And so they're worth the work, um, to create a good one. And like I say, they're meant to be enjoyed, not just endured. I love that so much. Um, Amy, where can people find you and possibly work with you as a coach and therapist or, you know, just learn from whatever you're sharing and posting? Yes. So you can go to my website.
It's Amy Gianni and Amy's A I M E E. Um, amygianni. com and, um, you can see me there and if you want to, um, do coaching, you can reach out to me there through my website. I also have, um, an Instagram, amygiannims, and I post several times a week there. And you can also, um, go to my website and sign up for my love notes where I send out, um, emails to your inbox.
Okay. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Amy, for sharing all of your wisdom. I just feel like I learn so much from you every time I'm around you. I'm a better person after I spend time with you. So thank you so much for sharing all of this with all the people who listen. Thank you for having me.
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